“Gaming will be streaming too,” says Kojima, drawing a direct line between the birth of movies and the theater going experience, to television, and now, to streaming. “In the near future, games and movies will come closer, in a similar category. So I think we’re going into an era with a lot of possibilities. It will not just be interactive or non-interactive, there will be something inbetween as well.”
Kojima is, among other things, known for directing video games with particularly long cutscenes, leading fans and critics over the years to accuse him of “cinema envy.” A self-proclaimed movie buff, Kojima has collaborated with a number of famous Hollywood actors and directors, including Guillermo del Toro and Refn. He may also be alluding to recent media like Bandersnatch, a choose-your-own-adventure-style interactive film part of the Black Mirror anthology series on Netflix, where viewers could make decisions that would affect the direction of the movie.
“So in the next five years, everything will change,” says Kojima. “Movies, music, games, how we distribute, how we share with each other, will definitely change, as art.”
According to Refn, the internet has transformed the meaning and value of creativity in society, making the means of creation more accessible. “Creativity is no longer controlled,” he says. “It’s no longer defined by a certain group or elitists or a definition. Creativity is you. You can all create, because we’re all human beings. And what the internet has allowed is that you cannot just create, you can actually share it.
“There is a whole era of opportunities that I think no one had ever imagined.”
Kojima also jokes about artificial intelligence taking over creative industries in the next 10 years.
“AI will create remakes or sequels automatically,” says Kojima, to audience laughter. “So who’s gonna win in this AI era? Nicolas [Winding Refn] always says, we’re gonna win.”
During the same panel, Kojima and Refn offered up more details on Refn’s mysterious character Heartman.